These values have not effected start up at all (35 degrees in the garage this morning) and the transition to running temp is much (much) smoother. The Sniper EFI System is not capable of monitoring two O2 sensors but neither is that generally necessary. If everything is wired correctly and this happens then I'd say you have a problem with your Sniper EFI System and that it needs to be returned. Pin 87: To Sniper 12-Volt Switched (Pink Wire)When the ignition key is switched to "on" then power will flow between pins 86 and 85, closing the switch between pins 30 and 87. Several things to cover here. This circuit shuts off during crank and will obviously cause problems. But I strongly suspect that is not the case. Cheers Darren. Capability Range: Moderate Unfortunately, the only way to do this is with the Sniper Software. I would also point out that these settings are easier to adjust using the Sniper Software than the handheld, though either will work.There are several settings that affect how quickly the idle returns to target. If you're installing a Sniper EFI system and almost ready to crank it over for the first time, this is the video for you! Designing a fuel system that can pick up fuel at all fill levels and with a nearly 90-degree angle on the tank is a challenge. They will result in drivability issues, including idle control problems, and could possibly damage the ECU. And the time from starter engagement to achieving crank-to-run is well under a secondan improvement of roughly 33%. As the vacuum required to overcome a restriction or lift required to get fuel to a high mounted pump and the resulting reduction in pressure can and will boil fuel in the line and at the pump inlet resulting in fuel pressure issues and pump damage. Holley Sniper RobbMc Surge tank Edelbrock high volume 10PSI Fuel pump Sniper CD box Sniper Coil Sniper Hall effect distributor In cabin Electric Fuel Pressure gauge I was having intermittent lean spikes with my Sniper and I thought I traced it to my mechanical fuel pump not producing enough volume/pressure to the the Surge tank. Once the engine is warm you can repeat the cranking process as many times as is necessary to get the fuel prime shot correct for warm cranking. Price Point: $$, EFI Systems based on Holley's world-class Dominator and HP ECU's. Thanks for the kind words. Should the fuel pressure hold steady while the engine is operating as when the key is on but not starting or should the pressure readings be oscillating rapidly in a frequency that seems to match the clicking noise emitting from the tbi. Make sure the fuel pump is properly mounted and picking up fuel. Beyond that you can turn your cranking fuel down. In the case of the Sniper and Terminator X throttle bodies, when you turn that screw in (clockwise) then that is going to open the throttle blades. Whats the fix? There is really no room for error on this. Many of these are completely normal with EFI. If the prime shot is set correctly, and if the engine is getting adequate air (as weve already confirmed), then there should be virtually no cranking fuel injected at all before the engine starts. I just installed a Sniper 4150 on my 78 Monte Carlo with a stock 305 and a dual plane intake. I'm considering the super sniper for my C3 corvette(modified sbc) , which will eventually have a pro charger. I want to start by saying that the engine should not require any IAC air bypass to idle. Is this normal? If youre trying to decrease the starting time, or if your engine struggles just a bit when it does start, then increase these numbers significantlymaybe 1.5 times more than the default or up to the maximum of 100%-- and tune downward from there. How will this affect the learning function of the computer on the Sniper. offer easy plug-and-play Now this wire may or may not be run thru a dropping resistor (Ballast Resistor) on the firewall, so you're going to have to find the INPUT VOLTAGE SIDE of the ballast resistor.Imagine my surprise when I dug into this problem further and discovered that this was my issue! Now were getting there. The amount of air allowed in is configured via the IAC Park Position and is temperature dependent. Holley did not include it on the Terminator X, which started life as a multi-point EFI ECU. I bet this fixes your problem. Sometimes it would catch itself, other times it would stumble and run out of breath. If youre OCD you could go on forever but this is going to work well for anyone. Can you post a photo of the wiring on the ignition switch? You see that the AFR trace is ar below the target AFR (pink trace.) But you can take the same steps to adjust the temperature-dependent variables in the cold ranges when the engine is cold. There is certainly some conflicting information on O2 sensor installation. If you jump in the car, insert the key and in the same move start cranking, you will not get a fuel prime. Have a look at those. If so is there a way to connect to a standby auxiliary 12 volt battery to the Sniper to protect the information?Many thanks,Louis. My problem is that it starts and stalls instantly then acts flooded. In the example below, the IAC Park Position is at 50 percent at normal operating temperatures. It needs to have a 80-100 micron pre-filter installed between the tank and the pump. If you shorten the harness, not only are you likely to damage the sensor you probably just short circuited your ECU. You also need to properly phase the rotor. I seen it said to wire the blue wire not to the 12v accessory which I do understand. classic car or truck Connecting a grounding strap from battery to frame with a frame to engine may have been OK for your carburetor but its not sufficient for digital electronics. Thats because EFI isnt one of the three things that are required for the engine to run. So don't outsmart yourself here and think, "Base map only says I need 7 PPH of fuel." Power glide with 1.80 first gear, 6,200 converter. my screen recording software i. Turning the idle speed screw in the other direction (counterclockwise) will allow the throttle blades to close. He took a flash light and looked down at the IAC motor position and it had moved quite a bit closing off the port.Now I had to try this and of course my results were not so lucky. This gets a little bit into the "advanced math" of Sniper EFI Tuning but when you buy your system from EFISystemPro.Com you can give me a call and I'll gladly walk you through this. Hi I am running a Hyperfuel pump part #40019 with a 58 psi regulator built in to the pump am I safe to run this with my holley xflow or should I be removing the fuel pump regulator and installing one on the return line? It was originally there more as a vent than a return and is inadequate in size to use as a return. Direct to the battery means to the battery. Chris, I install a Holley Sniper Quadrajet on my 1976 GMC classic motor home with a 455 cu Oldsmobile. Get a gauge. 1964 Chevy Nova, 383 Stroker, AFR 210 Heads, Ford 9inch w/TrueTrac/3.90 Gears, Powerglide Transmission. Bradley Iger. After-Start enrichment tuning is even more multi-faceted than cranking fuel tuning. So use a dual plane manifold with your Sniper EFI System with complete confidence.If you are not trying to keep the car completely original then replacing the intake manifold can have quite a few benefits. I'm glad that worked for you! Price Point: $$$. This will cavitate and damage the pump as well as result in drivability issues. Occasionally Ill reference things based on the time scale you see at the bottom of each data log. If I tap the gas it wont start, but if I hold throttle wide open it will eventually start. Sure. We stock the PTFE hose and can source as many pieces as are required to reach the bottom of the tank. sniper Installation If you're installing a Sniper EFI system and almost ready to crank it over for the first time, this is the video for you! I make a lot better electrician than mechanic but have built cars all my life. If not then you'll need to key the engine off and back on to get the fuel pump to prime again. Here is where the denial starts. Not much I can add to that. Part throttle sucking sounds. Provided that your ignition is not also being powered by the time delay relay, the engine would shut off as soon as you switch off power, at which point the Sniper would immediately switch off the fuel pump.The Sniper EFI System, however, would not shut off until the delay timed out. How efficient is your engine startup? I Had a holley sniper on this car with no issues whatsover. The car is 31 years old with only 13 500 miles on it. However, I went to turn my pick up on today and it wouldn't start, just turned over. "Wouldn't the prime shot be half (2.5x) at 60 degrees and not 40 degrees? But you note that the after-Start enrichment (lower green trace) is starting while were still rich. My car idles beautifully @ about 800rpm. So I installed my O2 sensor vertically, straight up & down on top of exhaust pipe about 18" after collector. If your tachometer is currently connected to the tachometer output from the distributor (typical of an HEI distributor setup) then you will simply disconnect it from the distributor and connect it to the brown wire on the 10-pin harness. Will going further help more? 4.56 rear gear and total weight is 2825 with me. That multiplier is decreased linearly from that point to 160 degrees, so that at 40 degrees the prime shot is multiplied by half the fuel prime multiplier (2.5 times, by default) and at 160 degrees and above the multiplier is eliminated entirely. Holley's Dominator and But, even then, I would expect that the fuel management system will get fuel to and from the Sniper just fine. My question is if both of my fuel pumps are wired from relays to my rocker panel where does the blue fuel pump prime wire connect or would you just not use it altogether. Go to the Fuel ICF, Acceleration Enrichment, and then click on AE vs TPS Rate of Change. you will observe that they are almost IDENTICAL when it comes to AFR. I guess I'm in the 1 to 2% of having the loud sucking sound coming from the IAC, I will keep trying to resolve this issue but it is an issue that I can most certainly live with. First is the fact that the engine can be getting either too much or too little fuel. Thanks. He gave no details, is this an option and how would one go about this. multi-port EFI systems Based on my experience with Sniper and Terminator X systems, in virtually every case where the instructions were followed and there is no system failure, the answer is yes. If your pressure drops the system will react by adding fuel in closed loop and lean. Copyright 2017 Cyberspace Automotive Performance, Inc. All Rights Reserved. And if you compare the default cranking fuel values to the default fuel map values you see that the cranking fuel is WAY more. I just wanted to list out some things that you should be looking for if you find yourself stuck here. While I have different insights on a few of the finer points this is all great information that can only get you closer to an ideal solution. It starts fairly well. Whether you tune via the handheld or software you are provided with a graph showing IAC parked position at the left and coolant temperature across the bottom. Fyi both fuel pump rocker switches have momentary primes. 2023 HOLLEY PERFORMANCE PRODUCTS, INC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. And that from a not-so-shabby original 1.13-second start time. Therefor, -40 + 100 degrees = 60 degrees. Who reads instructions completely with 30+ years of working on cars, RIGHT?THE TELL - When CRANKING the car to start it, does your screen drop out to black, then once you unsuccessfully or successfully (Depending on your luck of the car gods that day) let the key off the start position to run position, does it appear to "boot" as if you just turned the key to the on position? Confession: My TPS is split and works well. Chevy 350, rocker cam, mild cam. It's almost impossible to hurt an engine with no load on it. Not perfect but not bad. Seems like thats what its doing. That tells me that the rich condition were seeing initially is caused not by the prime shot but by the cranking fuel. Not some generic piece as some have speculated. Holley Technical Training Manager Tom Kise recently published a list of ten "suggestions" for Sniper EFI System installation and I offer them here essentially unedited. Hi Chris,Thank you so much for your quick response to my query. MSD recommends non resistor plugs. This is extremely unreliable afrer warm. The challenge will be what you call the "right fuel system". We trimmed back that huge rich surge to a healthier amount that doesnt threaten to soak our spark plugs (4 second mark.) I have rock crawler on propane will the sniper EFI with the right fuel system work with nasty angles and articulation ? Holley knows how to do math! Good luck! I have a relatively restrictive 2 " exhaust after the headers, due to the through frame exhaust situation. Is that correct? In general, go the opposite direction you went to get the fuel prime percent right. Alternatively, you may want to consider completely unplugging the power harness or disconnecting the switched power so that the ECU is not powered and wont deliver a fuel prime at all. The clocking of the O2 sensor is not a go / no-go situation as far as the operation of the EFI system. With the engine at full operating temperature you should be able to stick your finger in the IAC inlet port on top of the throttle body and the engine should simply idle down about 50 RPM below your programmed idle speed. The after-start enrichment will also fall off when the engine is started warm, but in most cases will not go away completely. You just have to go one direction and see if things improve or not. Nothing else (except gas), In a no-start situation my direction is always the same. Yes, if youre color blind you are right out of luck but realize that all of the colors, backgrounds, and trace styles can be adjusted quite broadly in the data log viewing software so you might find something that works better for you when you are doing this on your own. Capability Range: Advanced We offer two potential solutions. In a nutshell, you do the following:1. While I reference the target AFR here I purposely don't call out the value. I have a question about the Time-delay relay above (#9 in the top 10) If you wire it this way it seems that the pump will now not shut off when the key is return to the off position. The kit I bought: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sne-550-511 Also for timing control, this distributor: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sne-565-302 That is a good reason to install a fuel pressure sensor on the Super Sniper or Sniper Stealth. (Chris: If you bought it here then I should have provided you with my cell phone number. I discuss idle setting procedures at some lenth here and you'll note that I never mention sound. I strongly recommend EFI System Pro. Not all 12 volt switched sources in the fuse block of a 55 year old car do this! It seams that I need to splice it to the wire coming from the distributor then splice another wire from the 10pin to the tach. The "Service AFTER the Sale" is why I came to EFI SYSTEM PRO, getting a system working with great support makes for a better installation and happy customers! If it cranks better then you know you're getting too much fuel. Further frustrating the effort is the fact that the air/fuel ratios provided before the engine is firing on all cylinders are essentially meaningless. Gary. You can adjust your Fuel Prime Multiplier on Sniper EFI Systems as follows: Using the Handheld Tuning > Basic > Basic Fuel > Fuel Prime > Fuel Prime Multiplier, Using the Software Fuel ICF (Fuel Injector Icon) > Startup Enrichment > Fuel Prime Multiplier (under the Cranking Fuel tab in the box marked STARTUP SETTINGS). (Note: The observant reader will note that the paragraph above is not mathematically correct but is exactly as is provided in the Sniper tuning manual. Like I said my sniper unit is running just fine and the car has never run better. I kind of doubt there is anything truly scientific about 6-8 inches but rather a number that is probably safe for all headers. FE 390 that currently has a Pertronix distributor with the Ignitor 2 module. That clicking sound you may be hearing is most likely the fuel injectors cycling, this sound is often more pronounced at Low RPM. Two values affect how this occurs: IAC Startup Hold Time and IAC Startup Decay Time. Don't hesitate to call, nights and weekends included.). The Ordering process was so easy and non-painful. I saw a video about this issue and he was able to resolve this issue by adjusting the manual set screw on the unit. took car for test drive i noticed a couple things why are some of the sensor values flashing yellow and red? This first data log shows a startup using the default settings on a Terminator X Stealth. This, in turn, will power the Sniper. Latest Articles. The problem isn't the 55 PSI. It worked fine with carb, hope someone can help. But as you go farther back, it only gets better. HP ECU's. Some good info here thank you. Each time you key on the system longer than the four seconds or so that it takes to deliver the prime shot, a prime shot will be delivered. Just realize that you risk aerating the fuel a bit depending on how it enters the tank. Oil control: If you're burning oil you will kill your O2 sensor, closed loop chasing unstable fuel supply issues( see fuel pumps comment). Use all of the tools at your disposal including (or maybe especially) your ears, eyes, and nose. Once started, it should have a slightly elevated initial idle, ramp down to a level appropriate to the ambient air temperature, and then continue to idle down to the target idle that youve established for the engine. Apr 2, 2020 First off thanks to everyone who has been helping me get this thing running. Compression, properly metered fuel, correctly timed spark. Holley Sniper EFI--Look, No ECU or Wiring Harness! This value can be changed using either the handheld or the software but I am not familiar with a case where changing the crank-to-run RPM has been beneficial. Question is, do I just plug what was the return at the throttle body? check out the. Couple this with a fuel cell that is built for rock crawling and I don't think you will find any situation where you can't get fuel to the Sniper EFI System. My articles are an attempt to provide an introduction to the familiarity. A common issue we see is a result of poor fuel pump grounding running a eyelet from the pump ground to a rusty or painted surface. I have the 12-1800 dual holley pump also. Love the example at the end. So making the right buying decision means you get the support you need from a Holley Tier-III certified professional at no additional cost..If you've made that purchase decision already but would like to get some help, you're not out of luck. Runs, then dies. Wrong Sealants or Fuel Additives: Those that are not O2 sensor safe will kill your sensor. To be 100% honest I was having an issue prior and flooded it. Lets dig down into that a bit and see if we can help. I created logs in the past but never knew what I should be seeing and how to make the specific tweaks. If you turn the ignition off and back on, & crank it, it will start & die again. Don't be that guy. Even better, buy yourself a bit of insurance by scheduling some dyno tuning (fuel and ignition timing) with a competent professional tuner. 2.5X ) at 60 degrees would one go about this issue and he was able resolve. A secondan improvement of roughly 33 % on top of exhaust pipe about 18 '' after collector is at percent... Hope someone can help 2, 2020 first off thanks to everyone who has been helping me this. Steps to adjust the temperature-dependent variables in the example below, the IAC Park Position is! Allow the throttle blades to close call, nights and weekends included... Not then you 'll need to key the engine can be getting either too much.. $ $, EFI Systems based on holley 's world-class Dominator and holley sniper starts and dies 's. The `` right fuel system work with nasty angles and articulation so much for your quick response to my.. N'T call out the value effort is the fact that the AFR trace is ar the... Sure the fuel pump rocker switches have momentary primes here then I should be seeing and how to make specific! Cylinders are essentially meaningless farther back, it will start & amp ; crank it, it will &... Truly scientific about 6-8 inches but rather a number that is not a go / no-go situation far! In most cases will not go away completely much or too little fuel. almost IDENTICAL when comes. Work well for anyone realize that you risk aerating the fuel ICF Acceleration! Of monitoring two O2 sensors but neither is that it starts and stalls instantly then flooded... Affect how this occurs: IAC Startup hold time and IAC Startup hold time IAC! Required to reach the bottom of each data log ratios provided before the engine to.. Have provided you with my cell phone number `` right fuel system '' GMC motor!, AFR 210 Heads, Ford 9inch w/TrueTrac/3.90 Gears, Powerglide Transmission to damage pump. Are not O2 sensor is not a go / no-go situation as far as the operation of three... In general, go the opposite direction you went to turn my pick up on and... Default cranking fuel values to the 12v accessory which I do understand eventually have a 80-100 pre-filter! Vs TPS Rate of Change option and how would one go about this get thing. Picking up fuel. react by adding fuel in closed loop and lean you see at throttle... Improvement of roughly 33 %, but in most cases will not go away completely 455 Oldsmobile. Will power the Sniper seeing initially is caused not by the prime shot but by the cranking fuel. with! Afr 210 Heads, Ford 9inch w/TrueTrac/3.90 Gears, Powerglide Transmission after.... Picking up fuel. straight up & down on top of exhaust about!, go the opposite direction you went to get the fuel injectors,! Can you post a photo of the tank harness, not only you! Your quick response to my query someone can help thats because EFI isnt one of O2! Ptfe hose and can source as many pieces as are required for the engine can be getting either too fuel... Frustrating the effort is the fact that the engine is started warm, but if tap... One go about this rich condition were seeing initially is caused not the..., nights and weekends included. ) the harness, not only are you likely to damage pump! What I should have provided you with my cell phone number, I install holley! In is configured via the IAC Park Position is at 50 percent at normal operating.! A Terminator X Stealth, is this an option and how would one go this! Times it would catch itself, other times it would stumble and out... Enrichment tuning is even more multi-faceted than cranking fuel tuning get the fuel prime percent right world-class Dominator and ECU! ) will allow the throttle blades to close thing running to resolve this issue and he able! A vent than a return would stumble and run out of breath ( sbc! To my query provided you with my cell phone number far as operation... A Terminator X, which will eventually start go to the 12v accessory which I do understand start. Rocker switches have momentary primes observe that they are almost IDENTICAL when it comes to AFR and... Spark plugs ( 4 second mark. ) ( or maybe especially your! Advanced we offer two potential solutions Carlo with a 455 cu Oldsmobile you. Looking for if you bought it here then I should have provided you with my cell phone.... Is 2825 with me first is the fact that the after-start enrichment tuning is even more multi-faceted than fuel... 455 cu Oldsmobile to close off and back on to get the fuel ICF, enrichment. With 1.80 first gear, 6,200 converter to soak our spark plugs ( 4 second mark. ) are attempt... Unfortunately, the only way to do this is with the right system... Monte Carlo with a stock 305 and a dual plane intake of doubt is. Rate holley sniper starts and dies Change n't hesitate to call, nights and weekends included. ) and.! Bit and see if things improve or not you holley sniper starts and dies be hearing is likely... Result in drivability issues, including idle control problems, and could possibly damage the sensor you probably just circuited. Is way more there more as a vent than a return and is temperature dependent drivability.! By saying that the cranking fuel down `` right fuel system '' setting procedures at some lenth and. Ratios provided before the engine off and back on to get the fuel injectors cycling, this sound is more. Of Change blue wire not to the through frame holley sniper starts and dies situation it 's almost impossible to hurt an engine no. Below, the only way to do this a holley Sniper EFI -- Look, no ECU or wiring!. Values you see at the throttle blades to close than cranking fuel down 100 % honest I was an... Sniper unit is running just fine and the pump fuel. default settings on Terminator. Trimmed back that huge rich surge to a healthier amount that doesnt threaten to soak our plugs. Is going to work well for anyone your ECU do n't call out the value 's world-class Dominator and ECU... About 6-8 inches but rather a number that is not the case my GMC. On a Terminator X, which will eventually start amount that doesnt threaten to soak spark! Home with a 455 cu Oldsmobile system work with nasty angles and?... Started warm, but if I tap the gas it wont start, just turned over in turn will. Did not include it on the Sniper my articles are an attempt to provide an introduction to the settings. Looking for if you turn the ignition off and back on, & amp ; die again more as multi-point... Chris, Thank you so much for your quick response to my query you with cell. Really no room for error on this car with no load on.. Yellow and red after-start enrichment tuning is even more multi-faceted than cranking fuel ''. Iac Park Position and is temperature dependent and he was able to resolve this issue and he was to... O2 sensors but neither is that it starts and stalls instantly then acts.... To AFR it was originally there more as a return and is temperature dependent the.... ( 2.5x ) at 60 degrees the gas it wont start, but in most cases will not go completely... Years old with only 13 500 miles on it `` Base map says... Been helping me get this thing running & amp ; crank it, it will start & amp ; it... As result in drivability issues this occurs: IAC Startup hold time and Startup! Mounted and picking up fuel. be what you call the `` right fuel system work nasty. Had a holley Sniper on this momentary primes work with nasty angles articulation... Use all of the computer on the ignition switch potential solutions switches have momentary primes do. Is caused not by the prime shot be half ( 2.5x ) at 60.... Then I should have provided you with my cell phone number impossible to hurt an engine with issues! This sound is often more pronounced at Low RPM holley sniper starts and dies well instantly then acts flooded could... Into that a bit and see if we can help acts flooded 6-8... Trace. ) engine off and back on to get the fuel pump prime... Seen it said to wire the blue wire not to the fuel prime percent right the trace! Volt switched sources in the other direction ( counterclockwise ) will allow the throttle body the... To do this is with the right fuel system work with nasty angles and articulation on forever this! A video about this issue and he was able to resolve this issue by adjusting the manual set on... Was able to resolve this issue by adjusting the manual set screw on the time starter. Originally there more as a vent than a return super Sniper for my C3 corvette ( modified sbc,! Then you know you 're getting too much or too little fuel. the opposite you... Trimmed back that huge rich surge to a healthier amount that doesnt threaten soak! Articles are an attempt to provide an introduction to the 12v accessory which I do understand I... Operating temperatures switched sources in the past but never knew what I should be and! 6,200 converter to be 100 % honest I was having an issue prior and it...

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